Bitchery reader Yvonne asked a really good question:
I know you both have your hands full but I was thinking about some of the recent discussions and I had an idea for something else to touch on (HA!). Specifically, there doesn’t seem to be much masturbation in romance, although I have seen it here and there. Much more common in erotica, of course.
Examples that come to mind were the heroine in, I believe, one of the Kinsale books, and the OMG hot scene with Hades in P. C. Cast’s Goddess of Spring. Done right, as in both of these examples, it can convey so many emotions while still being kinda hot.
What do you think? Is it just too taboo?
Love to know your thoughts.
Yvonne does have a point - wanking is rare. My first response to the question is that perhaps it’s something of a taboo outside of sexually focused romance because the hero/heroine is supposed to be creating the sexual/physical response in the other, and if the h/h is creating that response on his or her own, then perhaps the reaction might be,"What do they need the other person for?” It may be a question of whether wanking would decrease sexual tension between the protagonists, because one or both of them is getting off solo. Add to that the often-grating virginal expectations of the heroine, and jack and/or jilling is not allowed.
I disagree with the idea, if it is indeed the case - most of the really hot masturbation scenes I’ve read (especially the Cast one) establish sexual tension between the characters sometimes without the two physically being present in each other’s company. And what could be more spicy than a heroine or hero spending time together, each knowing they’ve had a rocking orgasm while fantasizing about each other? Rwor!
So - what’s your take? Think wanking is taboo? And what romances have you read that feature hot self-on-self action?
Well, there’s Robin Schone’s famous example in her first book (name escapes me) in which the jilling off is how the heroine ends up slipping through time back to hero’s era.
I remember being stunned with arousal in Susan Johnson’s Blaze when the hero touches himself for the heroine’s enjoyment (or perhaps to point out his length, or something). It was the first time I’d ever read about a hero touching himself and it did very funny things to my insides. Still does.
There’s a scene in Alison Kent’s The Sweetest Taboo (category book) when the hero masturbates with the heroine on the other side of the door. Can’t remember if she’s listening or not. Definitely heightens the sexual tension. I know I’ve also read other categories with phone sex scenes.
Which Kinsale, pray tell? I can’t remember a masturbation scene.
If I’m remembering correctly, in JoAnn Ross’s Blaze the heroine fantasizes about watching the hero wank off which was very hot and then I believe they actually enact that scene later on. (or I totally fantasized that they did, which worked just as well)
Oh Yeah. And in Gabaldon’s Outlander series, (I can’t remember which book, it’s been a while) Jamie watches Claire masturbate on the bank of a river and it was hot. And it was a little fun too because he didn’t realize women did that so Claire, being Claire, educated him. :)
A common trope in Historicals seems to be Heroine gets Hero and herself all mutually hot and bothered, but they don’t actually get each other off, because of the usual social ruinin’ and shit m’kay?…
...and then we follow the Hero down a seemingly obligatory, yet utterly surreal internal monologue involving tightness of clothing, future inability to sleep at night due to sexual frustation, and a sudden mysterious inability to bring himself to visit his mistress or a prositute—a thing he’s done numerous times in the past—for reasons he does not yet understand, said inability causing him immense angst at the loss of his previously treasured dastardly nature.
...when any *normal* man’s internal monologue would be something more along the lines of ‘wank! wank! wank! wank! find place to wank! and change of undergarments! wank! yes, yes, yes! oh shit!
It makes me want to throw stale bread rolls at the guy every time the scene comes up :)
Loretta Chase’s Miss Wonderful has a scene in which the hero is trying to be honourable, so he helps the heroine to have an orgasm without penetrative sex. Then he gets distracted from his original intention and
He poised himself to enter.
She slid her hand down his belly [...] Then he felt her hand close over his rod. The thick, black world went blinding white, her touch a lightning strike, blasting through him. It jolted through muscle and pumped through vein ... and he exploded, spilling himself onto her belly (196)
I know that’s not precisely the sort of scene that’s being asked for, but it still seemed a little unusual.
Leslie Esdaile’s Through the Storm has got two parallel masturbation scenes, the first involving the heroine and the second the hero. As far as I can remember, they think about each other while they do it.
I do remember that when I wrote a wanking scene in Good Girls Do! (a 2000 Temptation) the proofreader reportedly jolted into my editor’s office with the wide-eyed question, “Do we DO that at Harlequin?”
Um...apparently, yes.
I do think it can be a very effective addition to a story. I’ve written at least two that I can think of offhand. I never thought about it being taboo in the least...but then, I’m like that.
Suggestions for hero masturbating:
Beyond Seduction by Emma Holly
The Conquerer by Brenda Joyce
Suggestions for heroine masturbating:
Lady Sophia’s Lover by Lisa Kleypas
Something Wicked by Julia Quinn
I’d suggest later Sabrina Jeffries and Hoyt’s The Serpent Prince--there’s more I could think of, but I have to run to work.
The first time I recall reading a pud pullin’ incident was in Brenda Joyce’s The Conqueror. Wow. It was really dirty! He jerked off behind a tree.
My personal favorite, however, is in Lover Awakened. I love this scene because Zsadist is discovering his sexuality, and Bella encourages him with “You’re beautiful when you touch yourself”. Very nice.
From Murphy’s Child by Judith Duncan:
‘Without looking at her, he turned and headed down the hall to the bathroom. He just couldn’t take it any longer. No damned way.’
or from Stevie’s Chase by Justine Davis:
‘Since he’d known nothing would ever really happen, he’d let his imagination have free rein in the dark hours of the night.’
In both those books it’s relevant to the story that the hero wanks, but, for myself, I’m happy just to have the information, I don’t need to follow him to the bathroom and watch him do it.
Mostly I just assume it’s happening, in the same way as I assume the characters are carrying out other normal bodily functions.
Different in erotic romance, perhaps.
In “Public Displays of Affection” by Susan Donovan, I remember there are some scenes early in the book where the heroine is having some vibrator fun while fantasizing about her hunky new neighbor (the hero, natch) and I think at some point he catches a glimpse of her masturbating when he looks out his bedroom window and can see into hers (although it’s been a while since I read that book, so I’m a little fuzzy on the details).
I seem to recall that the sexually frustrated hero of Connie Brockway’s ‘All Through the Night’ finishes himself off at one point. First time I recall reading it in a romance. (great book too)
...when any *normal* man’s internal monologue would be something more along the lines of ‘wank! wank! wank! wank! find place to wank! and change of undergarments! wank! yes, yes, yes! oh shit!
You forgot the early pornographic drawings he keeps in his underwear drawer.
I’m still waiting for some poor guy to suddenly go blind.
when any *normal* man’s internal monologue would be something more along the lines of ‘wank! wank! wank! wank! find place to wank! and change of undergarments! wank! yes, yes, yes! oh shit!
Hey. That sounds like suspiciously like my old man.
There’s a scene in “Worth any Price” by Lisa Kleypas where the hero has a wank over the miniature of the heroine - even though he’s not actually met her at this point.
There’s also several comic moments in “To Sir Philip with Love” by Julia Quinn where the hero refers to having to use his hand to relieve his sexual tension and at one point disappears into the ‘water closet’ to do just that after he has satified the herione.
“The Pirate Lord” by Sabina Jefferies has a great scene where the heroine comes across the hero pleasuring himself whilst bathing in the river. She finds it absolutely fascinating.
I’m sure there are plenty more, but I can’t think of any more example at the moment.
There is a scene in The Duke’s Indiscretion, by Adele Ashworth where the heroine walks in on the hero wanking it. He is seducing her a little bit at a time, and working her sexual frustrations. Eventually she gets frustrated enough and goes looking for him and walks in on him. They of course end up having intercourse, and the reader (or at least this reader) is left with the impression that he had been managing his frustrations by masturbating after he gets her all hot and bothered all those times.
I’m not even sure it was Kinsale. I keep thinking it was Seize the Fire, but I could be totally mistaken.
“any *normal* man’s internal monologue would be something more along the lines of ‘wank! wank! wank! wank!”
See, that’s the thing for me. The hero is always looking to nail some chick who LOOKS like the heroine or visit a brothel or something. In a more realistic sense, he would be pulling it somewhere and thinking of her. The heroine is often constructed with different standards, but I don’t really buy it that they aren’t having a little fantasy in bed late at night.
As a literary tool (hee hee) it could be great for advancing the tension and illustrating the kind of obsession that we often get in these. It can be so very hot when done correctly.
In any case, I just wondered why it wasn’t more prevalent. I do read more Regency and historical stuff, so maybe that has to do with it.
security word: purpose25
yea, sure, it has a purpose
There’s a fairly long thread on these scenes (men only) at the Romantic Times board.
I read mostly historicals and have never come across a scene of a woman masturbating. (Though apparently I’ve forgotten part of Outlander.) It’s very occasionally obliquely mentioned or “started” - The Serpent Prince is a recent example - but no follow through.
But who needs self pleasure when my screen provided54!
Well, I don’t know how much this has to do with the lack of wanking in modern romances, but the idea that masturbation is completely normal and healthy is a very modern idea. A 19th century hero and heroine--particularly the ‘gently bred’/aristo type that usually stars in romance novels--would’ve probably been taught that it was UN-healthy and made men weak and possibly deranged. Indeed, if they’d been caught at it as pubescent children, they might have been beaten for it, or worse.
Of course, I think it would be incredibly hot if the hero/heroine were so hot for each other that they gave in anyway, despite the ‘dangers’. Ha.
Think my first was in a Roberta Gellis (historical) book. The hero is torn between the sin of premartial sex and the sin of spilling his seed without possibility of procreation, because the church condemns both. He chooses to sin by himself, rather than involve his fiance also. Interesting concept from a religious historical point.
I much prefer a good wank scene to some of the more traditional overused sex scenes. Sometimes when the hero goes down on h, again, my brain kinda shuts down...like, can’t they do something else for a change?
“And what could be more spicy than a heroine or hero spending time together, each knowing they’ve had a rocking orgasm while fantasizing about each other? Rwor!”
I think in Lisa Kleypas’s Lady Sophia’s Lover, this is exactly how the heroine’s masturbation is used - to up the sexual tension when she’s with him the next day. And, indeed, rwor!
Well, I’m not in the company of the authors mentioned, except that I have a wanking scene in just about everything I’ve written. It’s a personal...um...favorite of mine.
I didn’t mean to say like twice. Like, really.
I write erotic romances, and I use masturbation in many of my books. MOON SHADOW opens with such a scene, but it isn’t gratuitous. The heroine is a wizard who uses hormones to make potions. To get the right hormones, she needs to make love, masturbate, etc. In the opening scene she’s casting a spell that hasn’t been cast in ages. You can read the excerpt at:
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?z=y&EAN=9780758214676&itm=4#CHP
But to get to the real question, I think a lot of erotic romance authors cover this topic. For masturbation to show up in straight romance seems pretty unusual. Diana Galbadon comes to mind.
No one has yet mentioned Linda Howard’s Mackenzie’s Mountain, when Mary asks Wolf to spend the night with her (after a traumatic event). Wolf does get in bed with her, but hightails (heh) it off to the shower to take care of his midnight cravings.
I’ve read quite a few books with heroes and or heroines “talking to the hand,” though this was much less common in the books I read even a few years ago.
Elizabeth Hoyt has such scenes in both _The Raven Prince_ and _The Serpent Prince_ (can’t recall one in the _The Leopard Prince_).
Annie Dean’s _Average Girl’s Guide_ features a rather hot phone sex scene. Does that qualify?
And I have a girl-with-a-vegetable scene in _Carnally Ever After_ that I’m rather fond of :).
Everyone’s got the book thing covered, but what about in the movies? Most romances or romantic comedies don’t even show Teh Sex anymore, what with the PG-13-ness of everything. The only scene that stands out in my mind is the very realistic phone sex scene in THE TRUTH ABOUT CATS AND DOGS.
Anyone?
Oh, and just to trash Auel some more, in THE VALLEY OF HORSES there is a brief, awful wanking scene. This is followed by a Big Misunderstanding and a few painful paragraphs about how the Great Mother Goddess hates masturbation.
‘Cuz the Great Mother is a big bitchy femmi-Nazi, I guess.
Since we’re broadening the media types, I have to bring up Sex in the City. Those girls wanked all over the place. Ahhhh...Sex in the City.....
Master of the Moon has a scene early on where both the hero and heroine masturbate (seperately).
Ward’s recent Lover Unbound has Vishous and Jane stroking his magic stick.
hmm, my security word is growth63.I used to think most commenters simply made those things up :)
So… am I the only one who went to the bookstore today!?!?
At first I thought, taboo? Really? It never occurred to me, since virtually everything I read has a masturbation scene of some kind.
And Randi has a wonderful point, because I think Sex and the City really changed the way women see, talk about and view their sexuality. The episodes on vibrators alone did a lot to bring them out of the closet, or more likely drawer, so to speak. If Charlotte, Miranda, Carrie, and Samantha are using one, why shouldn’t the average woman?
In “The Secret Passion of Simon Blackwell,” (sounds like it should be all wank all the time doesn’t it?)by Samantha James the super angsty hero has had all he can take of trying to keep his marriage “in name only” so he has to release some of the pressure.
A day or two later the heroine is trying to be shocking so she asks him if he ever pleasures himself and he is all “Where on Earth would you get a filthy idea like that?”
The Robin Schone book is called ‘Awaken, My Love’. I remember thinking that it was a very novel way to go about time travelling. Lucky for quite a few of us that it doesn’t really happen!
I don’t trust my memory on this one but I’m pretty sure that the hero in Behind Closed Doors by Shannon McKenna became quite familiar with his palm in that story. I’m going to have to re-read that I think… Just to check of course ;-)
Susan Johnson also has a book where the heroine begins to masturbate herself, with some sort of dressmaking tool, no less, in front of the hero.
Jo Goodman’s release this past month (title Wicked something or other??) has a great scene where the hero spies her in a bathtub and rushes upstairs to his room to jerk off in a rush of overwhelmed horniness.
I loved that, cliche as the setup was.
She’s a brand new discovery for me and I absolutely adore what she does with dialogue.
How could I forget? Hope Tarr’s Vanquished has both the hero and the heroine getting off to fantasies of each other.
Erotic romance is awash in H/H masturbation (uh, so to speak). It’s almost getting old-hat. What I think the genre needs are 1.) more GLBT masturbation scenes and 2.) more lyricism therein.
The latter element in particular has been sorely lacking in romance fiction, what with authors’ and publishers’ frenzied efforts to pump out as many “hot” titles as possible. All the jiggledy-pokery is getting pretty mechanical.
I’m currently working on a M/M story that I hope will put some of the poetry back into sex. That’s what I’ve been craving lately.
One of my favorite Temptations is Stephanie Bonds’ Too Hot To Sleep. The heroine programs her new phone’s quick dial list with the wrong number for her boyfriend. The cop she’s actually calling enjoys stealing the phone sex meant to pique the boyfriend’s interest. And that’s just the beginning :D
I’m a total hypocrite. I’ve written masturbation in some of my erotic titles but I don’t particularly enjoy reading about jacking or jilling. I guess probably because I’ve been single for so long, I don’t want my fantasies to be about one-player games. I want to read, fantasize, and picture multiple players!
The exception to this was in Zsadist’s book, as someone else mentioned. That was an extremely hot and… er… well-handled scene of sexual awakening.
I don’t particularly enjoy reading about jacking or jilling. I guess probably because I’ve been single for so long, I don’t want my fantasies to be about one-player games.
I’m kinda with you on this one. Masturbation scenes on the guys part or mutual masturbation is hot. Chick all by herself? Soooo been there, done that. I’m married but he goes away for very long work related chunks of time.
Jo Goodman’s release this past month (title Wicked something or other??) has a great scene where the hero spies her in a bathtub and rushes upstairs to his room to jerk off in a rush of overwhelmed horniness.
Funny, that’s EXACTLY the set-up in Hoyt’s “Serpent Prince.” Does he take the stairs three at a time, too? (Love that detail.)
I guess there are only so many scenarios one can invoke. I mean, without getting into things like dressmaking tools (????!! NOT looking that one up on Amazon!)
You know what, EMayne… I may have inserted the SP scene into the Jo Goodman. I read them both on the same weekend.
Good catch!!
I’ve just recalled another very hot wanking scene which is in Sabrina Jeffries’ Never Seduce a Scoundrel. The hero takes the heroine on board a boat without her chaperone and, well, she’s determined to remain a virgin and he’s determined to work around it!
God I love that book.
Wow! Thanks for mentioning my wank scene from Goddess of Spring. Hot little side note to the writing of it: to get inside a man’s head whilst he’s wanking I called my favorite lover, who happens to live several states away, and while he was at work (he’s a very hot marine attorney) he closed the door and, uh, ‘walked me through it’ from a guy’s pov.
I swear I still sweat when I read the scene.
The copy editor tried to get me to cut it, though. Said it was “voyeuristic.” (Hades is watching the heroine being bathed and annointed - she doesn’t know he’s there.) I was all, “Yep it is. Do. Not. Cut.”
Sorry if that was TMI about the writing process...my research is such hell...work work work work work.
The hero in Shannon McKenna’s Out of Control (Seth, one of my favorite heroes ever, in spite of the fact that I’d call the police on him in real life) gets the heroine to do an up-close & personal demonstration for him. I think he also wanks while spying on her, earlier in the book.
And I think in at least one of her other titles, there’s a hero “taking the edge off” in the shower… maybe in Standing in the Shadows?
In Susan Johnson’s “Wicked” the hero teaches the heroine to get herself off with a candle because he isn’t planning on sticking around for long, and in “Again and Again” the heroine does it with the handle of a hairbrush while the hero watches.
The Cowboy Way by Candace Schuler has the heroine masturbating outdoors and the hero watches with binoculars, then goes down see if she wants company.
I meant to say, Shannon McKenna’s Behind Closed Doors- that’s the one with Seth. And the wanking.
(How many times do I have to read a damn book before I’m clear on the title??)
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10.08.07 at 03:36 AM |