Smart Bitches Trashy Books | All of the romance, none of the bullshit.

Not your question but just a comment:
Think the violence and sex reaction is based more on a social view that violence is a public issue while sex is a private concern.

I have no useful info to offer on The Talk.  But I do, as ever, have a book suggestion…

Has anyone else read Sloppy Firsts by Megan McCafferty? This and the 2 follow-up novels aren’t exactly Educational, but there’s a good dose of realism and integrity in the entertainment. (There’s a fourth in the series, too, but I haven’t read it.)

The books follow Jessica Darling (budding Smart Bitch) through the latter-days of high school and on into college. And while there is some driving force to be found in the intense romantic plot line, (involving fascinating/frustrating reforming-bad-boy Marcus Flutie -think Jared Leto in My So Called Life, only much smarter), the relationship is woven in and out of the bigger story of Jessica making her decisions about who & how she wants to be. 

It’s YA & up; probably more appropriate for high school than middle school. There are some elements that you probably don’t want your kids contemplating too far in advance.

A cover blurb says, “Judy Blume meets Dorothy Parker,” which seems pretty accurate to me. Fun books.

No kids, but I will say what book they shouldn’t be given-- the little book that mothers use to order from Kotex to explain things to their daughters.  Mom gave it to me to read and that was sex education circa rural 1965.  I wasn’t the least naieve because we lived on a farm and-- well-- animal sex and procreation is mainly what a farm is about.  But I have to say the book squicked me out for a while.

“A man will teach his wife what is needed to arouse his desires. And there is no reason for a woman to know any more than what her husband is prepared to teach her. If she gets married knowing far too much about what she wants and doesn’t want then she will be ready to find fault with her husband.”

Unique vantage point of Dame Barbara Cartland.

Kids are smarter than people give them credit for, so when it comes to The Talk, speak to them as if they’re adults, not children. You’ll have to worry a whole lot less if your kid feels like they can actually talk to you. If you shut them out when they ask questions, giving them answers like “because I said so” or “when you’re older”, they’ll generally just go looking for the answers elsewhere, and they might find them in the wrong place.

As for Gossip Girl...It’s just a book. Raise your children properly and they’ll understand that it’s just a book.

I have twins (one of each).  They are going to be 12 way too damn soon.  My daughter will NOT talk about sex.  I’ve bought her books, asked if she’s ready to talk about it and told her I’m here if she has any questions at all.  It grosses her out still.  I’ve seen a crack or two in her philosophy in the last week or so, but she isn’t talking to me.

My boy, on the other hand, has questions all the time.  I answer as honestly as possible (I’m not going to go into detail about my past).  He also goes into his room for privacy a lot.  He progressed from saying ‘I’m using my privacy’ to ‘I’m playing with myself’.

If he has thought about something long enough to articulate a question then I feel he needs answers and I’d rather he got my thought/feeling/opinion than that of his cohorts…

I have refused to pay for cable.  My kids don’t watch a lot of ‘regular’ t.v.  They do like the Simpsons.  After that is on though, they get kid movies/videos and/or old t.v. shows (gotta love Netflix) on DVD.

I’m sure they’ll still need therapy for something because for everything I do right I figure there is something I’m doing so very wrong without even realizing it…

Sam…

I think Forever is a fantastic book for kids about sex, because the characters act like teens and SPOILER ALERT do not stay together afterwards.  The books shows the girl’s mom admiting that she had sex before marriage too, and has Grandma getting the heroine birth control.  Oh, Judy Blume, how I worship thee.  The only bad part is it encourages teenagers to think they are always going to orgasm together, which, no.

... and now my mnd blanks on all the books I read before romance novels.  I knwo I read a LOT of young adult stuff, but I will have to mull this over.

Meg Cabot, who is a big proponent of sex *before* marriage, does a pretty good job of tackling teen sex realistically in Ready or Not, which is the sequel to All-American Girl. I’m not a huge fan of either book, mostly b/c the heroine kind of annoys me, but I think Ready or Not, with its attention to details like birth control, anxiety, social expectation, and abstinence-only education is very well done. Meg’s YA books are never graphic, however. The sex is very much a fade-to-black.

The Earth, My Butt, and Other Big Round Things tackles not only masturbation and sexual experimentation, but date rape and a girl really coming into her own. I strongly recommend it. Plus, it’s all over the banned books list--who can resist?

For LGBT teens, or teens who are actually interested in reading about those who might be LGBT, I very much like Julie Ann Peters’ books. Again, as I recall from the one I read, she’s not graphic. Luna is about a transgendered teen (girl in boy’s body) and her sister. I haven’t read that one, but I did read Keeping You Secret, which is about a young lesbian couple. It’s heavy-handed, but that might be necessary, all things considered.

Not that it deals with it as the main topic, but I really enjoyed the way Mercedes Lackey dealt with homosexuality in her Magic’s Pawn series.  (Even with her penchant for high drama.)

It was the first time I read a book that had two characters of the same gender become involved, and helped explain a lot.  And the fallout that the characters experience is reasonably true-to-life as well. 

If I had a child who was a sci-fi/fantasy fan, I think I’d put that on the shelf as part of a well-rounded sampling of literature.

I have three teenage daughters and I write very sexy books, so I was all prepared for the in-depth talk. But none of them really wanted to have it!

They have been raised in a home with two very demonstrative parents, and we’re frank in all aspects of life, not just sex but also religion, politics, etc., so they’re very open minded girls. But they get squicked out at the thought of reading one of my sex scenes (though the 16 year old reads my books if I paperclip the sex parts together so she can skip them.) Many of their friends read them, however.

I did get them the American Girl book on body changes when they were nearing puberty, and every time they took a sex ed class in school, we’d talk about the physical stuff and I’d answer any questions I could get them to ask. (My youngest had only one question after her 5th grade sex ed class..."why do they put perfume in sanitary pads?” Oy.)

Since they really don’t want to talk mechanics, I focus on the emotional aspects, the dangers, repercussions, my own screwups (numerous) the need to make choices for the right reasons, and drilled in them that I’d much rather take them to the dr to get on the pill than to get a pregnancy or STD test.

First and foremost, though, hubby and I have tried to convince them of their own worthiness as individuals. They have self-respect, which a whoooooole lot of young girls seem to be sadly lacking these days. We had that very conversation last night after watching an episode of DeGrassi in which a teen girl gets a green bracelet because “every player gets a prize” when the girls blow the hot guy in school. Those are the kinds of conversations I think are most important and my kids are open to them because the groundwork has been there since they were very little.

A (childless) psychologist friend of mine pointed out that if I answered all of my children’s questions when they were small and curious and not too embarrassed to come to me for answers, then I could give them accurate information rather than having them pick it up from questionable sources or their friends.

Easier said than done of course!

I’ve tried to be accurate without giving more detail than they want or need. I have a boy and a girl and they are quite aware of their anatomical differences! I have not as yet gone into how Tab A fits into Slot B…

I remember my mom gave me The Talk before I was actually interested in or curious about sex.  I was eight, and she wanted to make sure things got hashed out early enough that I’d understand the whole puberty thing before it actually started happening.  She was just very matter-of-fact about it, and gave me an open invitation to come back and ask questions whenever they came up.

Oh, Judy Blume, how I worship thee.  The only bad part is it encourages teenagers to think they are always going to orgasm together, which, no.

And in the case of many, many teenage girls, maybe not at all.

I think these days, teenagers, even ones who have done “research” on their own, are often as in the dark about sex as we were--for the opposite reason. We didn’t have enough information. Kids today have waaayyyy too much. The internet is no place to learn the basics of sex. Fetishism is so rampant on the net that it comes off as the norm of human sexuality. There’s no training wheels anymore. No first, second, third base. No bell curve of discovery, just an instant education that will burn you retinas right off.

Makes me long for the innocent days of Playboy.

No kids and not really an answer to the question, just a thought.

Sex (and violence) in books have been with us for a long time, and I’m pretty sure they’re going to stay with us. I remember all of the furor over Judy Blume and the Sweet Valley Highs. I knew girls (and boys!) who weren’t allowed to read them. Didn’t really matter, however - you guessed it, they read them, anyway.
The names are different, but the concerns are probably the same. I can honestly understand a parent wanting their child to read the best, the most thoughtful and literary, and perhaps the safest. But curiosity will always run rampant, juicy stories will always make the reader turn the pages. And, to be fair - young readers are exposed to this and worse everyday. Be it by television, film, magazine, certain celebs’ (mis)behavior, talk and goings-on at school…
I think as long as the kids have a parent (or guardian) that they can talk to, they’ll be fine.

A sex ed site that covers about every issue from anatomical to emotional.
http://www.scarleteen.com/

Speaking as someone who’s still a teen, and whose mom’s attempt at the Talk is only five years behind her…

For the Talk, go into it expecting your child to know more than she does. Because she probably will. I had an older brother, access to the internet, and learned early that the parental controls didnt block book reviews on Amazon. So when my mom sat me down to try to explain things, and used her gentle, you are a child and I’m an adult and this is important so pay attention voice, I hightailed it out of that room as fast as I could. I was twelve, I’d already figured out how to sneak an erotica into the house (a m/m/f threesome, if anyone’s interested) and I did not want to hear it.

I still dont want to hear it, either. My runs through Health class every year have to be the most awkward moments of my day. I sit there while the teacher makes an awkward connection between ovaries and beehives, or loses her overhead and has to draw on the board, or tries to act like the movie on the screen isnt showing a penis getting hard in infared as she fast forwards past it, and think that my brother explained all this to me much better when I was 8.

As for YA books...generally, then and now, they make me mad. Because so many are fade to black or little impersonal distant two line descriptions. The covers promise me that its “dark,” “erotica,” and “edgy,” but when I actually get to those dark, erotica, edgy parts its just stupid. Granted I was never really into YA books, even when I was in Elementary and Middle School, and I’m sure many of them are good. But dont try to censor which ones you buy for your kid, because its only going to lead to them, if they were interested, going out to find something better.

The internet, btw, is as mentioned filled with information that gets past those annoying parental controls. And even if it doesnt, chances are your kid knows how to bypass the parental controls, or if she doesnt she’s going to figure it out. But dont go to her thinking all she knows is BDSM, whips and chains and naughty school girls. Because it may be all she’s seen, but theres a strong chance it isnt all she knows. Respect her intelligence in that manner, because my mom didnt when I was 12, and she is still positive that those nasty romance novels I read are going to make me want to jump any passing guy I see and invite him to ravish my with his throbbing manhood, and add some chains in too, please.

(Sorry if I got a bit ranty...the way stuff like this seems to get handled rankles a bit)

If by “do for sex what Are You There God, It’s Me, Margaret” did for the period, Peaches meant “make the adolescent E.C. go ‘Just shut up about it already!’” I suspect that there are a lot.

Seriously, I suspect the Forever recommendation is a good one from what I’ve heard, although you might be able to tell that I didn’t read much Judy Blume.

I read Madeleine L’Engle’s “House Like a Lotus” when I was a teenager (around 15).  It deals with big, important things:  adults who fall of their pedestals, homosexuality (lightly), sexual harassment, losing one’s virginity (in a really realistic way, albeit with a bit of the fade-to-black stuff, although it was enough to get me excited at fifteen), traveling alone, making decisions about one’s romantic life, etc.  Not L’Engle’s *best* book, but one that helped me as a teenager.

I also just finished reading a new book called “Wicked Lovely.” The premise is that this teenage girl sees fairies, and a fairy king sets his sight on her—she has to figure out how not to get taken in by the fairy king, whose love could do scary things to her.  She has a boyfriend who is older and realistic about sex:  she knows he has had lots of sex, but he’s very clear about not pressuring her, not rushing her, making sure that everything they do is what she wants.  And even though she thinks she wants to have sex, he waits longer.  They talk a lot about their relationship, and about sex.  It’s a good book about communication and waiting, while also being sex positive.

I second the statement about Scarleteen.com.  I also highly recommend Positive.org.  It’s based on the idea of being sex positive, and talks about various kinds of sexuality, gender issues, safe sex, how to stay clean and healthy, whether or not to have sex, where to get help, etc.  It’s a great resource.  (Starts off with the sentence: “You have the right to complete and honest sex education.")

A local Planned Parenthood may be able to offer more resources - they’re really good at that stuff.

Three teens 15 to 19, boys & girl.  Haven’t done just one big “talk”, more into small conversations as stuff comes up...moments of opportunity.  Like in the car or late night yaks after games or movies.  I try to be open, positive, and not condemning...in return they will discuss surprising subjects. 

YA books & romance...the daughter didn’t get into them (yay).  Dance class 3 days per week, friends, AP english (her choice) and its required reading kept her very busy.  When she expresses interest, I share my adult books with her.  I choose them carefully for what she enjoys & minimal sex b/c that is her comfort level at this time.  Wicked Lovley is very good, will pass it to daughter next time she isn’t plowing through schoolwork.

We have basic sattelite, much more likely to find teens watching the History channel, Discovery, etc. than sex and/or MTV.  Anything history, myth busters, what not to wear, csi, etc. are big in our house.

Nudity on TV...not likely, makes mine uncomfortable.  Teasing stuff (Tokyo Drift) they like, but true nudity (new Dracula for school project) squicks them.  They fast forward themselves.

Bottom line, I make sure my kids know I love them, like them, and enjoy them (well, not the dirty sox).  When we have problems, I make sure to seperate disapproval of behavior from my approval of them as a person. Hey, I have wonderful kids, growing up to be fabulous adults!

In my job as a children’s librarian, I’ve come across a lot of YA books that are wonderfully honest about the experience of sex and relationships. I feel like the best ones show how you can’t get one without the other. That’s not to say they all have HEA’s--far from it. But the characters are affected deeply. It’s a nice change from the sterile bedhopping that seems to be presented as the alternative to Puritanism.

Partial list:

Pop! - Audrey Wallington
Getting It - Alex Sanchez
Doing It - Melvin Burgess
Lost It - Kristin Tracy
The True Meaning of Cleavage - Mariah Fredericks

How do parents get kids to have long, frank talks? Every time asked my daughters if they wanted to talk about their feelings, they responded, “I feel bored. Can we do something else?”

They are great, articulate kids, and seem to have and to be growing up with good friends, and without drugs, unwanted pregnancies, or arrests so not having “the discussions” does not seem to have been an issue.  Still, I wonder…

If they avoid the conversation they are telling you they either don’t need it or are not ready for it yet.

I have a set of childcare rules.  My brothers and friends can either accept them or find alternative means of childcare.  One of them is:

They can read anything in my library, but only if they are willing to have a discussion, with me, about the content.

Solves everything.  Surprisingly, a few of them have called me on it.  It led to some cool discussions.  Not surprisingly, more often than not they aren’t interested once they know it would require a discussion.  NOT because the sex, violence, or other themes would be uncomfortable to discuss, but because they don’t know that’s “in there” and don’t care to read it.

The ultimate result?  When they stay here or visit, if they are interested in a book or even a movie, they ask for me to recommend one.  In fact, they call me quite often to ask.  (I used to review movies for a living and was a teacher for a while… so you’d think they’d run the other way.)

We underestimate kids.  Big time.

I got The Talk when I was 10; my mom and I went bra shopping. She covered everything - biology, how things actually worked, and her values and opinions on the subject. I still think it was the best information I got on the subject - and we had 6 *years* of in-depth sex-ed in my school district, not just the boys-in-one-room, girls-in-another puberty talks that I know a lot of people get stuck with.

It’s how I plan to talk to my daughter about sex - before she can have a real attitude about it, and before she asks her friends or Google. My mom was very matter-of-fact, and not at all embarrassed, which helped *a lot*.

I just don’t understand some parents’ reluctance to realize that their children are going to be sexual people, just like they are. I hope I never have that outlook towards my girl, because I’ve always found it limiting, silly, and usually applied with a heavy handed dose of sexist assumptions.

If they avoid the conversation they are telling you they either don’t need it or are not ready for it yet.

Hmm. I have to disagree with that statement, if we’re talking 12 and 13 year olds. I would agree if we’re talking younger than that.

I’m a h.s. teacher, and I do the sex talks at my school because I am pragmatic, unshockable and well-educated on sexuality. Also, because the kids need it. So many students are so relieved to finally be able to get answers for questions for which they are curious, but are too embarassed to ask their parents about. And many parents have said they are happy that we do the talks, because they just don’t know how to talk to their kids about sex.

I provide plenty of well-written books on my shelved about sexuality and relationships and believe me, those bad boys are dog eared and in demand.

I just want the students to get good information to help them lead happy, healthy lives. Is it optimal for family to be this source?  Of course! Does it always happen? Not by a long shot, so I play back-up.

My mom gave me The Talk every year before school started starting when I was about 5 or 6.  And each year, she broadened the topics and gave more specific information.  I squirmed and held my hands over my ears, but I heard and remembered what she told me.  In fact, I corrected a lot of my friends’ misconceptions about puberty and sex!

She also let me read her romance novels from the moment I asked if I could.  Sex was not a taboo subject in my house, but she was always tactful about how she explained the mechanics of it.  It was violence that she censored in our reading and tv watching.

It seems to me that that is the way to do it.  I’d much rather kids grow up seeing two (or more) people pleasuring one another than blowing (hmmm) each other up.

No kids, so I’ll just recommend books.

I’ll second Forever, Meg Cabot’s Ready or Not, and Maureen’s suggestions.

I’d also recommend:
It’s Perfectly Normal by Robie Harris; non-fiction for tweens
Hooking Up: A Girl’s All-out Guide to Sex And Sexuality by Amber Madison, which I haven’t read, but have heard good things about; non-fiction for teens
Anatomy of a Boyfriend by Daria Snadowsky
A Bad Boy Can Be Good for a Girl by Tanya Lee Stone
The Making of Dr. Truelove by Derrick Barnes, which is the only book I can think of besides Doing It with a male narrator(s)
Good Girls by Laura Ruby
Fly on the Wall by E. Lockhart

And I’ve mentioned elsewhere that I think Ali in Adios to My Old Life and Paski in Haters get pretty awesome sex talks from their single fathers, in a funny, awkward, sweet kind of way.

For more book suggestions, check out, this site and this one.

Seems to me the bottom line is this:  Books, television shows, movies, and any mass media blah-de-blah should be largely irrelevant.  Good parents open the lines of communication from an early age on, and they don’t rely on someone else’s approach springing from some current pop-psychology Oprahesque purview to teach kids what they need to know in order to function as responsible, caring adults.

Yeah, RAH-RAH hip books and all that crap...but only if they serve to reinforce your and/or your partner’s life-experience standards (and, let’s hope, they’re good ones).  Too many parents today are buying into the “Oh me oh my, I need some expert to tell me what to think/say/do!” philosophy.

Bullshit. 

Lay the foundation yourselves, then let good books build upon it.  (And I firmly believe exposure to gratuitous violence should be kept at a minimum and directly addressed as an issue in and of itself.)

No kids, but I will say what book they shouldn’t be given-- the little book that mothers use to order from Kotex to explain things to their daughters.

Oh, hell yeah!!  DS, I thought I was the only one who got those.  By the time I received them there were 4 or 5 one for each stage of development with the last one being for marriage.  In fact I still have them, don’t know why I can’t bring myself to throw the stupid things away?  My mom gave them to me, told me to read them and then asked if I had any questions.  She seemed so relieved when I said, nope. 

As for the books, I read Forever and I loved how it didn’t have a HEA.  I knew even then that it was more realistic about things. 

As for “talk” suggestions, my sister-in-law took my nephew on a weekend camping trip to broach that subject.  She said getting away one on one with no media helped to break down the walls and make him more open to talking with her.  I wonder if a similar thing wouldn’t work for talking with girls as well.  A girl’s weekend, maybe to a cabin or a long drive to a park where you can walk and talk just the two of you, with no distractions.

Erin, I was actually referring specifically to the parent/child relationship.

I think it’s actually healthy to have kids feel comfortable with a secondary source.  I know I was, and I’ve often found some moms and dads push so hard it becomes creepy and intrusive.

I’ve been godmother/aunt/teacher in the role of trusted confidante… it was a terrifying blessing.  And while I was super happy to be the one trusted with “I need the pill” and “I think I am pregnant,” I also never judged the parents who freaked the fuck out when I held the kids’ hand and nudged them to speak.

I knew if I was the mom/dad hearing it I’d be freaking the fuck out, too.

Margaret Mead wrote about the importance of these secondary adult figures.  She was a smart, smart lady!

My boys are 10 and 9, and only the 9 year old has shown any curiosity in how babies get made.  Since we don’t watch TV (only the occasional movie or 80’s Transformers cartoons or something on DVD) I always have NPR on in the car so I can get the news, and at that time they were interviewing a man about the difficult questions kids ask.  And then they get to the “biggie” and how to handle it.

My son--"What’s the biggie?”
Me--"Sex.  You know, where babies come from and all that.”
Him--"Oh."
Me--"Do you want to know?”
Him--"Uh, okay.  Is it gross?”
Me--"No, it’s not gross.” Starts explaining things like, you know babies grow in a mother’s belly, in an organ boys don’t have, etc…
Him--"Wait… how’s the baby get out?”
Me--"There’s another opening for a girl, between where you pee and where you poop.  It’s called--”
Him--"You lied.  This *is* gross.  Talk about something else!”

And thus concluded our first sex talk.  I’m not sure if that was good or bad, actually, and I feel like I really should know.  I mean, between being a nurse and being an erotic romance author, shouldn’t I have done better on that?

Oh, well.  He hasn’t asked me anything else, but I still feel the urge to whip out a drawing of girly bits to show him.  God knows what he’s picturing now after our rapidly-aborted conversation.  *snort*

Then again, I’m really treasuring these years where my boys are completely unconcerned with sex and girls (or boys!) for as long as they last.  I don’t want to push him with more information than he’s ready to handle.  It’s gonna get complicated soon enough, no need to rush it!

You know, after typing that and reading the comments through, it’s struck me that my boys and I have had lots more talks about homosexuality than heterosexuality.  Again with NPR in the car triggering the conversations, we’ve discussed what it means to be gay, lesbian, or bi (very simply--when boys fall in love with boys, or girls with girls, or anyone who loves either--trying to keep it on a level they understand right now) quite a lot.  In fact, with the same son I mentioned above, we talked about gay and lesbian marriage and why it should be okay and legal.

Him--"So you mean if they pass this law, you could marry a girl if you wanted?”
Me--"I’m not a lesbian, but yes, that’s right.  If I loved girls, I could marry one.  How would you feel about that?”
Him--pensive silence for a minute--"No."
Me--"No?  Why’s that?”
Him--"Two Moms would be WAY too many rules.”

God, I love that kid… he sees right to the heart of the matter.  Ha!

Well, this is an aussie book, so I don’t know if you get this over there, but if you can it is a truly excellent book. “Looking for Alibrandi” by Melina Marchetta.

It’s about 10 years old now, and I know the YA scene has changed a fair bit, but my younger sisters have both read it, and both love it so it can’t be too wrong. It’s really well characterized, and deals with sex, drugs, alcohol, cultural and family issues, school and suicide. It sounds like a lot to fit in a book, but it’s still one of my all-time fav books. If you can get your hands on it, it’s really worth a read, and lots of re-reads.

Apart from that, my daughter who is only 6 has asked me where she came from etc, and has stated her opinion she came from my bellybutton. I don’t have the guts to tell her different at this stage. I thought I would wait, but reading some of the comments above, maybe I will screw up my courage and give her a practical little explanation. Better now than when she is a teenager and doesn’t want to hear a thing I can tell her!

Just throwing my 2 cents in as well. I can’t give any book suggestions (been way too long since I read anything considered YA), but I have to agree with everyone else in saying that giving The Talk early is a good idea. In my case, I honestly don’t remember getting it, though I know I did, I just didn’t care ;-) I was a precocious reader and was many years above my age in reading ability. This meant that books geared to my age were written way too low and felt demeaning to me (and thus, weren’t interesting) or I’d read them in a day. Books that were at my reading level were probably not ones that other parents would have wanted a kid to read. I remember reading romance novels back in 5th grade, and when browing bookstores for more books, the other ladies in the aisle all giving me concerned looks. Of course, Mom was right next to me browsing for her own, so when we left, we just giggled at the ladies. Mom knew that at that age, if I hadn’t gotten interested in romance novels (or she couldn’t find some other genre I’d read), that I’d probably have stopped reading for pleasure as much as I did, and definitely would have suffered for it in terms of grades in school.

Let the kids explore what is out there, but leave yourself open to questions. Also, be prepared to filter, but based on what the kid likes and is able for.

Oh, and for those who might think romance novels may not be the best thing to give to an elementary school girl (especially in terms of giving the wrong ideas), I’m still a virgin at the age of 26. :) I have no problems with my sexuality, I just haven’t found anyone I want to share it with.

“...has stated her opinion she came from my bellybutton. I don’t have the guts to tell her different at this stage.”

Hey pkg-
When I was maybe a little younger than your daughter, I asked my pregnant mom how the baby would get out… she told me, “God makes a special opening in a woman’s body big enough for the baby to pass through.” Which was a satisfying answer for me at the time.

I do remember examining my own stomach very carefully later on, trying to see where the miraculous opening might someday appear.

When I was a bit older, she gave me some clearer details. I have to say, I kind of liked my original concept better… :)

Kate

I have to say Degrassi (the newer version even more than the old one, if only because kids will do nothing but laugh at they hair and clothes in the old version) has blown me away with its frank, honest depictions of the whole gamut of teen sexuality issues.  You have the biggies: coming out of the closet, abuse, abortion (find a US-made show that deals with THAT in plain language!) but it is also great for the smaller, more individual issues: the boy who thinks his penis is too small after seeing his girlfriend’s previous bf in the gym shower, “saying no” to sex with one boyfriend even though you had sex with another (abstinence-ed seems to focus so much more on being a virgin from the get-go, as opposed to what happens if you have sex and THEN decide to wait?), the complicated results of adding alcohol and/or drugs to hormones.

I heart the show in a big way, and not just because Kevin Smith did a few episodes.  I think it is a must-watch for Jr High and up.

My kids and I play Halo together. Which is pretty damned violent.  Why? Because they are exposed to so much outside our family bubble, my husband and I opted to find out what the video game stuff was all about. We never had a game system until our son turned 13. My son doesn’t play sports (he has difficulty tracking) and this was his way to be with “the guys”.  I approved, which is saying something because I was always a knee-jerk “NO WAY” kind of mom about video systems.  We are all now heartily addicted. We join teams, capture the flag, and slay each other on a regular basis. Sounds horrible, right? My kids actually chose having a family xbox night over other activities. We scream with laughter, eat naughty snacks, and have an absolute ball. And now that I have 2 in high school, that’s saying a lot.

Books, movies, music, tv shows, friends: they all expose our kids to a variety of ideas both good and bad. But the bottom line? I’m raising these kids. It’s my job to talk to them and to make myself available for them to talk to me. Music especially opens doors to conversations.  The first time I sang along to fifty cents “candy shop” I thought my older daughter was going to die from embarrassment. But it led to conversation. I try to recognize an opportunity when it presents itself.

I have never had the ‘talk’ with my daughter, I just answer any questions she has, as and when they arise - often in public and at quite a loud volume. The first time this happened I just told myself that I was glad she felt comfortable enough to ask me and I answered her questions even though Tescos(supermarket) wasn’t my ideal place for discussing periods with an eleven year old. The most memorable conversation took place in a bookshop and concerned homosexuality. I explained that some girls had a girlfriend rather than a boyfriend and likewise a boy could have a boyfriend rather than a girlfriend. After confirming that yes such a relationship would include kissing, I was shocked when she said that it was disgusting and that ‘there was something wrong with them’. I was gobsmacked by her reaction and even though I explained that there was nothing wrong or disgusting and it was perfectly normal for that person and that she might even be gay, she insisted that it was wrong even adding that ‘God mustn’t like that person much if he made them like that’, even though I hadn’t mentioned God at all. I remember dreading how she would feel when she realised that sex involved more than kissing!  Fortunately as she has matured her views have changed and she is a lot less judgemental at 15 than she was at 12 and is supportive of a friend who is struggling with his sexuality. Can anyone could recommend any YA books for boys dealing with this issue besides the Julie Ann Peters and Mercedes Lackey ones mentioned earlier? I have the Magic’s Pawn series but its been a while since I’ve read them so I’d forgotten about Vanyel.

I did not have “the talk” with my daughter and son. I have had, and keep having, the talks, because it never really ends. When they asked a question, it got answered, clinically, without judgement. But I didn’t give them more information than they asked for. As they got older, the questions got more specific. So did the answers.

I think most parents get nervous about sexual curiosity because that means the kids are thinking about doing it, right? Wrong. They’re just curious. And I want to make damn sure that my kids come to me for information, not their friends or the internet.

Last year, my then-5-yo asked how baby hamsters get out of the mommy hamster.  I explained, using clinical terms.  When he asked how human babies get out a couple weeks later, I was able to reference the hamster conversation.  A couple weeks ago, a friend was watching my kids and Aaron informed her that he knew all about sex but not to worry, he wasn’t going to tell her kid ‘cause he’s too young.  (the kid’s 5)

I don’t remember any one specific “Talk” as a child.  My parents answered my questions as they came up.  I do remember a picture book that had a tomboy nicknamed “Horse” getting her period and being sure she was bleeding to death.  And by the time we had sex-ed in sixth grade, they weren’t telling me anything new.

Jo-

Try Brent Hartinger’s Geography Club, which is about a guy struggling with his sexuality, and how he and his friends deal with it. It’s a *little* unrealistic, only b/c once the one kid comes out to his best (girl) friend, she turns out to be bi, and then the queer kids just come crawling out of the woodwork. That aside, it’s a great read, and I strongly recommend it and its sequel, Order of the Poison Oak, though I don’t like that one as much.

For that matter, it might be worth looking at the banned books list for 2000-2007--anything banned for homosexual themes is a good start.

(Confirmation word? felt25. Ahahahaaaa.)

I think a family Halo night is an awesome idea.  My boys and I do somewhat the same thing, only with Baldur’s Gate and other sword-and-sorcery type games.  (What can I say, I like my violence a bit more up close and personal… shooting someone from across the room isn’t fun for me when I can hack ‘em to bits with a battleaxe instead!) There were several discussions of the difference between fantasy and reality, mostly for the benefit of my eldest due to his Autism--sometimes he has trouble seeing that line.  But all in all, it’s a fantastic way to have fun and bond with my boys in a way that also affirms their… waaah, I have to say it… manliness. 

Which isn’t to say that we don’t do other things together, too--in fact, my 9 year old wants me to teach him how to crochet.  Both his father and my dad either knit or crochet, so he doesn’t see it as a girly thing to do.  It’s good to support all sides of a kid.

We had a brief bit of “Talk” last night, when he asked me what it meant that our dog was “fixed” because he didn’t think she’d ever been broken.  Explaining what got removed and why was enough for him, and referencing the “gross” conversation we’d had in the car helped.  Little steps, I suppose.

There have been lots of recommendations for YA books that handle the hard themes such as drugs, suicide, homosexuality, incest, rape… are there any books that introduce regular kids to reasonably realistic adult heterosexual relationships without all the angst and without getting all syrupy?  Or does that make for too boring a story and it will never sell?  Do kids today still have to go, as I did, from Nancy Drew (I’m trying to remember if she ever actually kissed Ned) to James Bond in one fell swoop? In modern terms, I suppose, it’s Pony Club to Anita Blake.

I’m not a parent, but I would hope that romance writers explain that the mores found in romance novels aren’t necessarily valid ones. It has nothing to do with virginity or erotic romance but, IMO, the sexual hang-ups promoted in the genre. >.|

Sex is Fun did two podcasts on this topic.

ONe is an mp3 they encourage you to spread to any teen you know who needs information on sex: http://sexisfunradioshow.blogspot.com/2007/03/sif-61-last-episode-of-sex-is-fun.html

The other was a parent’s guide for talking to your kids. http://sexisfunradioshow.blogspot.com/2006/08/sex-is-fun-32-how-to-talk-to-your-kids.html

Also http://midwestteensexshow.com/
which is a videocast, pro produced about teens and sex. Good stuff.

there are many teen realistic fiction titles that handle sex in a positive way.  check-out the work of the YALSA committee, Popular Paperbacks for Young Adults, http://www.ala.org/ala/yalsa/booklistsawards/popularpaperback/nominations.cfm#sex.  we’ve focused on gathering nominations of books that portray sexuality in a non-doom-and-gloom way.  feel free to nominate titles appropriate for the list - perhaps an adult romance that’s liked by a teen in your house?

i applaud parents who recognize that using books as a tool for discussion can provide a healthy outlet to discuss potentially uncomfortable topics.  as we all know, sexuality is an important part of being a teen.  thanks to the bitchery for engaging in a rational discussion on this subject!

marin younker
ppya chair

I have no children and don’t recall having any form of “the talk” with my mom, but I am a children’s bookseller and see a lot of different titles in both fiction and non-fiction that include sex and puberty.

There’s a new non-fiction book called “Doing It Right” by Bronwen Pardes that is really good for older teens. It’s the best new book on an old subject that I’ve seen in years.

As far as ya fiction that handles the subject well, some recent favorites are:
Nick and Norah’s Infinite Playlist by Cohn and Levithan
Good Girls by Laura Ruby
Wicked Lovely by Marr

and on the boy struggling with his sexuality question, it may be a bit young, but Totally Joe by James Howe might be a good addition. (The Misfits is a better book, but Totally Joe is actually about Joe finding his voice.) It’s not entirely believable, but Joe is a wonderfully quirky and likable character.

My parents did several talks (when I had my first serious boyfriend) and also left me with “Where Do I Come From?” as a kid. I was a voracious reader and read all kinds of romance stuff. I can tell you that none of it actually prepared me for how sex feels and how it works in reality. However, I didn’t have sex until I was 25 and then I made darned sure I was protected. Judge as you will.

My word is child81...er, no thanks. 81 kids is a bit much. Even twelve, as in The Family Nobody Wanted, are too much.

In spite of it’s age, I agree with those who said Forever by Judy Blume.  Because it’s realistic.  Not only is there not a HEA between Katherine and Michael, but it takes a few times for Kath to really enjoy it, let alone have an orgasm.

In terms of something more recent, I thought Ann Brasheres did a good job with Brigette and her experience in the first Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants book.

Earlier this year, my 7-year-old used the phrase “make sex.” Which perplexed my husband and I, since it’s not a phrase either of us has ever used.  I’m still not entirely sure what he thinks this encompasses but have stressed that if he has any questions, he can ask either of us.

More recently, the issue of homosexuality came up.  And it was all my fault.  We’d been watching the new season of Who Wants to be a Superhero? and it was the episode where Parthanon was asked to leave.  I made an off-hand comment about “So much for the first gay superhero”, not thinking anything of it.

Our son immediately fixated on that and said, “What do you mean?  He doesn’t make sex with another boy???” So I explained that while there were people like his father and I, who liked people of the opposite sex, sometimes men like other men and women like other women and it’s all OK. 

It’s the never knowing what exactly they know that gets to me.  *sigh*

Yeah, my school did the separated films about “your special time” (periods). But I went to a Catholic School, so that’s sort of what you expect. I got a greater education from reading Playgirl when I was in 7th and 8th grade. I also got to see my first uncircumsized penis in one. Before that, I thought that men without foreskins were standard issue! (Well, you do see so many more of them, to be honest.) I also used to rent gay smut films (Including one called “Pleasure Beach” featuring an orgy filmed from beneath! It took me several minutes to figure out what exactly I was seeing on the screen.... What really squicked me about that one was how cardboard the single woman in the film was… but then, this was a *gay* film! ;) Oh, and the bad lines!)

I’ve had young friends ask me questions, and told my friends I would gladly be a loving auntie to their kids, and I will be open and honest about sex with them. I don’t plan to have any of my own, and the time for that is quickly passing me by anyway. I don’t see anything wrong with alternate sexualities (gay, bi, etc.) although I think doing it with animals is cruel to the animals.

(I just noticed that, my Ghod! IMDB has the movie up and it has two reviews!)

I made an off-hand comment about “So much for the first gay superhero”...

Try Hero by Perry Moore, which I would also recommend to Jo.

Off the top of my head I can’t think of any books for YA with sex in them.  But, I did want to talk about the topic of speaking to your children about sex.

My parents firmly believed that it was important for us (myself and my younger brother) to know what sex was.  They felt it was important to give us the correct facts and not the weird made up nonsense so many kids have because their parents get all squicky about talking about it.

I can’t remember a moment in my life where I didn’t know what sex was.  I think I was about 4 when I asked my mom how babies were made.  She very calmly answered the question in a way that my 4 year old brain could understand it.  As I got older, the answer became more detailed. 

I think that’s the best way to handle the sex question.  Don’t be embarassed and don’t make it into a big deal.  I’ve had to tell my friends about sex (when I was much younger) because their parents made them so uncomfortable and embarassed.  It’s a natural part of our humanity.  Don’t make it dirty...it’s not.

Just my 2 cents.

Oh, this brings back memories. My mother is very repressed about sex. When I got the Talk, I was 15, and it consisted of the statement, “you know it’s not really like it is in those romance books, right?” And I was able to agree that it was not, from first-hand knowledge, because I’d already been having sex for 6 months at that point. Not that she knew that, or even would have considered the possibility.

I can only hope I’ll do better with my own kids. But honestly, that’s almost a given with that precedent, right?

(the captcha knows what we’re talking about - my word is parts14)

For homosexual relationships, I champion David Levithan’s Boy Meets Boy.  It is a very funny, sweet book, and it is one of the few books I know about a teen homosexual relationship that is mostly angst free.  The world of the story is a mostly happy, accepting world.  I think that’s a story that hasn’t been told much.

I think Forever is still more daring than a lot of modern YA books.  Francesca Lia Block’s books can spark some interesting conversations thematically, but are definitely fade to black books in their detail level.  Someone mentioned Doing It by Burgess, which I love.  In the fantasy world, Tamora Pierce’s books are fun that way - birth control discussions (in a magic type way) and all.  I can’t think of many modern books for the YA crowd that discuss male-female sexuality in a positive-outcome way.  Most of the ones I’ve seen are focused more on the issues (pregnancy, disease, abuse) and less on the complexity of emotions.  I do think that The Perks of Being a Wallflower, while not a book about sex-stuff per se, has some great, sensitive depictions of problems real teens might encounter.

I wanted to recommend TIPS ON HAVING A GAY (EX) BOYFRIEND by Carrie Jones. The book opens with the heroine’s boyfriend coming out to her. They had a loving, sexual relationship, presented matter-of-factly, and we get to see each of them dealing with their changed relationship as he comes out to the rest of their high school. Sensitive issues treated realistically and with a sense of humor that arises from the funny, smart characters. My 15-y-old daughter and I both loved this.

Meg Cabot’s The Princess Diaries series (in addition to the All-American Girls series) were so refreshing to read compared most books read by Gen-Y kids.

For a good YA read on too-early, not-that-great sex and its aftermath, can I recommend Sara Zarr’s Story of a Girl?

is it just me or are there a goodly number of teenage girls commenting on that article that make me want to slap them silly? I remember being a teenager, a younger one at that. I remember thinking my mom is a moron, which I still think she is, but for reasons I can’t tell you about at this moment. I still feel embarrassed to be around my mother, again, for very personal reasons. But to bitch at the poor woman for voicing her concerns over what her daughter reads makes me livid. MY granpa even said he agreed with these girls, which makes me batshit insane with rage and hurts more than a little to know he agrees with someone I would love to kill and rid this world of. How could he understand these girls when they’re simply voicing vapid responses that should be slapped down with a sledge hammer every time they speak?! This is the future, ladies and gents! My generation’s irritating to me already, now I’ve got the newer generations making me angry with every new step they make.